England (Internationals)

Reading an article rating each individuals tours and Pope and Foakes got 4 out of 10, the only player lower was Bairstow. You wonder what some people expect of Foakes what exactly has he done to be singled out as poor. He exceeded specialist batman Baistows contribution with the bat and showed how valuable he is as a wicket keeper. Maybe we should judge some alleged all-rounders like Rehan Ahmed on how poor they were with the bat. We did actually win one test on a man of the match performance of Pope, backed by Foakes, if one or two other batsman turned 30s and 40s into centuries then I'd support some of the rankings, Duckett got ranked 6 as did Root, and Stokes 5 out of 10.

Foakes was brilliant keeping, letting very few byes go past while standing up to the stumps on turning pitches and taking almost every chance he got. He batted sensibly helping to eke out runs from the tail, usually after the top batting collapsed. I would say he was one of the better tourists.

They probably gave Atkinson a low score as he did not take any wickets.

Crawley 8 - very solid and consistent but without the big scores we would have liked to have seen
Duckett 7 - often content to be second fiddle to Crawley and did play well in partnership, but averaged poorly against the ball turning away from him
Pope 5 - one exceptional innings, but too many absolute howlers; a 3-ball pair in Ranchi didn't help
Root 6 - improved as the series went on and ended up being England's best batter in the last two tests
Bairstow 2 - lots of starts but no innings of note
Stokes 4 - poor with the bat (bar Hyderabad) but captained very well in difficult circumstances
Foakes 6 - great keeping, and two good supporting knocks, but without a big innings of his own
Ahmed 5 - did OK with the ball but didn't stake his claim as second-choice spinner that he went into the series as
Hartley 7 - good but did occasionally get the treatment, ended up averaging 37 which wasn't great
Wood 3 - apart from his 4-fer in Rajkot took no wickets in the rest of the series, also well down on pace and disappointing
Leach 5 - hard to judge but most economical bowler on either side despite injury
Anderson 6 - very good on unhelpful wickets, and the second-best seamer in the series
Bashir 7 - bowled well and outdid most expectations
Robinson 1 - hopeless; 0-54 in the series and was expensive too

I think this article from Sky is very fair about where England go from here. https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/12123/13091763/bin-off-bazball-move-on-from-jonny-bairstow-what-about-ollie-robinson-decision-time-for-englands-test-team

Hartley's bowling average of 37 was, I'm pretty sure, better than his showing in last year's CC.

Harsh on Bairstow and Robinson. Probably right Bairstow position in the side at risk but there does seem to be agenda against him.

Ollie Pope is he a Test Match Number 3 I’ve got my doubts.

Jhe10077 wrote:Ollie Pope is he a Test Match Number 3 I’ve got my doubts.

Possibly not. He does like to walk down the pitch a lot. I think he has adapted somewhat, but the problem I think he has is the same as Root: they don't seem to be able to decide whether to belt it out of the park or play a sensible innings in line with the situation in the game. Now I read today that "feet up" McCollum says "it's the end of the beginning". Eh? So that could mean we replace BazeBall with RootBall or Wonky Pope Ball. They just could go back to playing proper cricket instead of T20, but I wouldn't bet on it.

I think some of the criticism in this thread is unwarranted. They're playing the best they have done since the early Bayliss days.

This is a good read. https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/ind-vs-eng-a-project-in-the-balance-as-england-confront-the-need-to-evolve-1424555

RB wrote:I think some of the criticism in this thread is unwarranted. They're playing the best they have done since the early Bayliss days.

This is a good read. https://www.espncricinfo.com/story/ind-vs-eng-a-project-in-the-balance-as-england-confront-the-need-to-evolve-1424555

Well playing "the best" has resulted in a 4-1 hammering by an India side missing 3 key players, actually probably 4. This article is ok but doesn't address the fact that most of the top order can't seem to adapt their game. For India some of these pitches were good batting tracks, imagine if they had been raging bunsens. I'm beginning to think some of these players need to stand down. But at least they have Sri Lanka and the Windies next which should be fairly easy, but mmmm.....

Only an opinion but i don’t we would’ve scored more by pushing and prodding.

RB wrote:Crawley 8 - very solid and consistent but without the big scores we would have liked to have seen
Duckett 7 - often content to be second fiddle to Crawley and did play well in partnership, but averaged poorly against the ball turning away from him
Pope 5 - one exceptional innings, but too many absolute howlers; a 3-ball pair in Ranchi didn't help
Root 6 - improved as the series went on and ended up being England's best batter in the last two tests
Bairstow 2 - lots of starts but no innings of note
Stokes 4 - poor with the bat (bar Hyderabad) but captained very well in difficult circumstances
Foakes 6 - great keeping, and two good supporting knocks, but without a big innings of his own
Ahmed 5 - did OK with the ball but didn't stake his claim as second-choice spinner that he went into the series as
Hartley 7 - good but did occasionally get the treatment, ended up averaging 37 which wasn't great
Wood 3 - apart from his 4-fer in Rajkot took no wickets in the rest of the series, also well down on pace and disappointing
Leach 5 - hard to judge but most economical bowler on either side despite injury
Anderson 6 - very good on unhelpful wickets, and the second-best seamer in the series
Bashir 7 - bowled well and outdid most expectations
Robinson 1 - hopeless; 0-54 in the series and was expensive too

I think this article from Sky is very fair about where England go from here. https://www.skysports.com/cricket/news/12123/13091763/bin-off-bazball-move-on-from-jonny-bairstow-what-about-ollie-robinson-decision-time-for-englands-test-team

I find giving an opening batsman a rating of 7 or 8/10 when they haven't scored a century, a bit over the top. Crawleys 407 runs in 10 innings is above average but Ducketts 343 runs is bang average. If like Kawaja they'd occupied the crease for more technical players to score quickly then great, but they didn't. Stokes got 199 runs in 10 innings, so his position in the side has to be questioned if Foakes scored more runs but is being rumoured be dropped this summer. Only 2 England players faced more balls than Foakes (521) to Roots 649 and Crawleys 594 balls. Obviously that stat isn't something worth anything under Bazball. If Pope is being lambasted for only having one big innings on tour (196), Duckett only had one big score aswell (153).

IMO ECB should be getting all centrally contracted players playing County cricket in April and proving their ability and hopefully playing themselves into from.

Sadly Bairstow has chosen the IPL riches instead, for him to walk straight into the test side against the West Indies after playing no red ball cricket between now and then would be laughable.

Chris Jordan for England? - Guardian have same story here as do the Telegraph here

Talk Chris Jordan might be going to World Cup in June. (to replace Overton, who replaced Stokes)

Overton back injury

If Jordan is also signed up to the Carribean T20 he'd also be missing whole of July for Surrey too.

So we'd presumably need to appoint a new T20 Captain?

We'd have Jacks, S Curran, Topley and Jordan all missing if articles above correct. (all agree on squad below)

Not losing Gus Atkinson would be the big postive.

Looks like someone has leaked the England T20 World Cup squad:

Jos Buttler (captain), Moeen Ali (vice-captain), Phil Salt, Will Jacks, Jonny Bairstow, Ben Duckett, Harry Brook, Liam Livingstone, Sam Curran, Chris Jordan, Tom Hartley, Adil Rashid, Jofra Archer, Mark Wood, Reece Topley

England T20 World Cup squad confirmed

IMO this squad is best case scenario for Surrey, we've lost 3 white ball players and kept Overton and Atkinson in our ranks, only real missing player is Will Jacks.

Jos Buttler (capt, wk), Moeen Ali, Jofra Archer, Jonny Bairstow, Harry Brook, Sam Curran, Ben Duckett, Tom Hartley, Will Jacks, Chris Jordan, Liam Livingstone, Adil Rashid, Phil Salt, Reece Topley, Mark Wood.

Rehan Ahmed and Chris Woakes seem to be the main players who've missed out, be interesting to see who is selected for Pakistan T20 series in England, with the likes of Buttler, Jacks, Bairstow, Curran and Topley all missing - rested post IPL.

If Archer also rested presumbly Atkinson will come into that England team and perhaps Jason Roy opening, would be nice to actually see him play at the Oval once this season!

I agree, I think we have done well out of that squad

The article on the BBC also states that those in the IPL will be back for the Pakistan series, though how much they will play is another question

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/articles/c6pylnje8d2o

Moeen Ali STILL getting picked. Easily the most overrated English player in the last 30 years.

Coatesy wrote:I agree, I think we have done well out of that squad

The article on the BBC also states that those in the IPL will be back for the Pakistan series, though how much they will play is another question

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/articles/c6pylnje8d2o

"The same group will take on Pakistan in a four-match T20 series, which begins at Headingley on 22 May.

The eight members of the squad currently playing in the Indian Premier League, including Buttler, will return for the beginning of that series. The captain could, however, miss some of the Pakistan series for the birth of his third child."

It would have been quite ludicrous to have to bring in atleast 4 players who weren't going to the World Cup to play that series (alongside the 7 not playing in IPL)

"The ECB have made members of England's T20 World Cup squad unavailable for the IPL play-offs and will call them home ahead of a four-match T20I series against Pakistan which starts on May 22. As things stand, the decision is likely to affect Jos Buttler (Rajasthan Royals), Phil Salt (Kolkata Knight Riders) and Moeen Ali (Chennai Super Kings)".
cricinfo story

Playing in IPL: (8 players)

Jos Buttler (captain), Moeen Ali (vice-captain), Phil Salt, Will Jacks, Jonny Bairstow, Liam Livingstone, Sam Curran, Reece Topley.

Not playing in IPL: (7 players)

Ben Duckett (3 county matches for Notts)
Harry Brook (4 county matches for Yorks)
Chris Jordan (last played in March in Pakistan Super League)
Tom Hartley (1 county match for Lancs, v Surrey, India Test Series)
Jofra Archer (not played this year)
Mark Wood (not played since India Test Series in March)
Adil Rashid (Last played in February - International League T20 in Dubai)

Probably won't bother watching it.

VicNorth wrote:Probably won't bother watching it.

But we'll hopefully all be watching Gus Atkinson playing county cricket for Surrey!!!

Glamorgan (a) Worcestershire (a) and Essex (h) during this International period for us in County Championship.

I'd be as happy watching Tom Lawes.

Rob Key: "The decision on who keeps getting n the test team won't be on if someone has played Championship cricket or not"

Oh good grief.

VauxhallRey wrote:Rob Key: "The decision on who keeps getting n the test team won't be on if someone has played Championship cricket or not"

Oh good grief.

Seriously I've read the article about 5 times! https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/cricket/articles/c87z33vnmmvo

So Phil Salt and Jonny Bairstow by not keepng wicket playing white ball cricket are advancing their credentials to be England Test wicket keeper

While the bloke who impressed in India behind the stumps and is keeping wicket in domestic cricket (when allowed to by the ECB!) isn't

FFS Rob Key really has lost the plot!

Oh well, all the better for us, I suppose.

FFS

Why is Phil Salt even anywhere near the Test team?

VicNorth wrote:Why is Phil Salt even anywhere near the Test team?

Seems the only criteria to being a good wicket keeper is being able to hit 30 runs in 20 balls and get out in a blaze of glory.

The stupidity of Key knows no bounds. What incentive is there for players playing championship cricket when he makes crass comments such as these.