Yorkshire CCC - what a disgrace

I am pleased to see that Yorks sponsors are deserting them thick and fast. To try and ignore/ cover up/ pass off as banter these issues is truly mad and out of kilter with how most people think in this day and age.

If the board don't resign then I sincerely hope the ECB temporarily revoke their test ground status as punishment.

There was an incident around 5 years ago when we were playing Yorks and I was sat talking to one of their travelling members in the pavilion. He was well into his 70's but suddenly came out with the line "I like that young P@ki lad you've got playing for you". I was speechless, not only is this outrageous thing to say, he said in a casual way as if there was nothing wrong in making this comment. I know one swallow doesn't a summer make, but if this is indicative of the culture then its time to burst the boil. Yorkshire is a multi cultural place and cricket should be for all.

couldnt agree more, and am glad to see that the ECB have punished them by not allowing then to hold International fixtures in the near future, and that the Chairman resigned this morning.

It seems Vaughan is in trouble as well, though he denies it

Will Yorkshire/ Headingly be allowed to host The Hundred in 2022?

plgwbl09 wrote:Will Yorkshire/ Headingly be allowed to host The Hundred in 2022?

No, they won't. Some would see that as the opposite to a punishment but financially it must be.

The key thing, I think, is that they will not get the matches back until they haver demonstrated they have got on top of this. If they can do that through cleaning out the board and senior management, they might well get the matches back again. After all, the ECB probably reckon they need a strong (respectable) Yorkshire. Right now it looks as if the relatively good guys are the ones resigning because they have failed to convince the other board members that there really is a problem, but maybe that is a means to force the others out.

One interesting take on the White Rose forum is a contention that the top level is really the North Yorkshire county cricket club and that attitudes in that area differ markedly from those in South and West Yorkshire, where there are substantial ethnic minority populations. I'm in no position to judge that but it has surprised me sometimes to hear the worst stuff said about other groups from people living in areas where those groups barely register in the population.

Another strange thing is that Colin (100) Graves is being touted as the replacement chairman; but didn't Rafiq's earlier claims of racial abuse happened during Graves previous tenure? Could the recall be because Mr Graves and his family have ploughed loads of money into Yorkshire CCC? Or am I being too cynical?

Presumably as he didn't get the top ICC job, Graves is looking for another way to demolish the County Championship with Harrison.

If Headingley is not allowed to host The 100in 2022 - where will the Northern Superchargers play their fixtures - Durham?

Without getting into the racial why's and wherefores, despite the fact of not investigating this incident properly, does the severe punishment here fit the crime? All Yorkshire Members will suffer and 1000s of the general public who are denied, certainly as things stand, access to Internationals. ( I don't really give a stuff about the 100). It all seems to be getting out of hand, and I just wonder if the ECB are trying to save face and weedle Graves back in for some dubious reason as kjb says above.

Durham would appear the most obviously suitable alternative, though I admit to not caring very much  if the Hundred is thrown into a panic. If I was a Durham member I wouldn't want it there, and it's not as if they owe the ECB any favours.

With regard to Chinaman's previous point, the punishment is far from unduly harsh in my view. Yes, of course Yorks members will be deprived of international cricket temporarily but - as a membership club just like Surrey - any central punishment on the club will necessarily have some adverse result on the membership, be that financial in terms of increased fees to cover for lost revenue or whatever. I think they've got off pretty lightly so far, and indeed it may well get worse for the club. We shall see (that is, if they ever get round to publishing that report that they won't even let Rafiq see in full). And, equally, is Yorkshire cricket in such health that it can afford to alienate the entire local non-white population?

I admit I am one who normally revels in watching Yorkshire cricket's peculiar expertise in chasing its own tail and trying to bite it off, they have previous form for laughable mis-management, but this whole episode is far more serious, and it is not a hole they can dig themselves out of without genuine structural changes.

This is not merely Yorkshire's normal incalcitrance on display (they make even the MCC look like hip young woke trendsetters by comparison), nor merely a peculiarly inept and unconcerned committee at work, but moreover it is an indication of a hard-set and archaic reluctance to simply accept change for the better. I am imaging the likes of Boycott, sat in his expensive chintzy living room, mumbling "Bloody storm in't teacup to my mind. Just words, in't it? No harm done to the lad so what's he mithering on about?"

Mark Ramprakash's comment yesterday that Yorkshire CCC needed "to be dragged into 2021" was succinct. If they won't regulate themselves to the standards and expectations of the rest of the cricket world, then they bring shame and opprobrium on cricket and must be punished accordingly. I was pleased to see they have already lost most of their major commercial sponsors, but I would suggest a one year club ban from all first class and list A competitions might shake them conscious pretty damn quickly.

Can I also just add how nice it is to discover this re-born forum purely by chance after wondering what had happened to the old one. Nice to see some regular names again!  I presume Marcus just pulled the plug on the old site after it was inundated with tiresome idiots?

The DCMS appearance today is something else. Suspect Sky and the Beeb will be making sackings this week. Alex Hales is now never, ever going to play for England again, I suspect.

Always good to watch Harrison have a car crash, though.

I agree its been abhorrent and shocking to listen to it.

Vaughan's post cricket career in media is finished - nobody will touch him with a barge pole now.

Gary Ballance should fair no better. I don't know if the ECB can ban him from any involvement in professional cricket going forward, the RFU did it to Dean Richards over bloodgate for 2 years. Hales has been a cock for ever and this just confirms what a toxic turd he is.

Its one of the few times I 've been proud to see parliament do its work!

Is there anywhere I can view the interview/interrogation?
I note that Essex have been brought into the situation.
I do hope Surrey have behaved themselves but I worry a little about Ansari and Stephen Davies during their time with us.

kjb wrote:Is there anywhere I can view the interview/interrogation?
I note that Essex have been brought into the situation.
I do hope Surrey have behaved themselves but I worry a little about Ansari and Stephen Davies during their time with us.

Yes, you can go to the www.parliamentlive.tv website, put in the necessary details and they'll e-mail you a link for the whole 3+ hour hearing which is valid for a couple of days.

Alternatively, you can use the link they sent me which has a couple of days left on it:

https://parliamentlive.tv/Download/Index/ad4f9222-47b4-43f8-a37d-003fe3763abe

I'm watching it now and coming to the end of Rafiq's testimony.  He spoke very well and is totally credible. It's awful to listen to in places. Harrison and Hutton up next, where I expect the credibility to take an almighty dip.

This is opening up a giant can of worms that will likely tear cricket apart, and maybe other sports as well. Whatever your view there will be no winners here.

I fail to see how it will "likely tear cricket apart". That is hyperbole worthy of the tabloids, but in reality, of course, cricket will be fine ultimately. If it leads to the removal of thoughtless, unsuitable and self-protecting administrators, and a shaking up of the status quo, then the winners will be cricket's future, natural justice and human dignity. I think those are all very definitely worth several cans of worms being opened. Besides, what is the alternative? Pretend there's no problem and plod on regardless? Yorkshire have already tried that, and look where its got them.

Well it's hardly hyperbole, it's happening right now. BBC headline " cricket is institutionally racist". Whose going to be the next county? The problem is some of the "worms" happened years ago and are being racked up on social media, and will ruin careers of at least some who were a bit young and immature at the time. No one is squeaky clean in life. You can change the rule book but I fortunately not the way some people think.

That BBC headline is actually a direct quote from Rafiq rather than a statement of fact. It does not in itself indicate the imminent death of cricket.

Cricket needs to accept the issue exists and deal with it constructively and honestly in order to resolve it, and it cannot do so by refusing to recognise there is any issue in the first place.

As for old social media posts made by players now in their mid twenties, the ECB's kid-gloves handling of Ollie Robinson this summer shows that careers will be by no means ruined, and they are going out of their way to turn a blind eye to hateful comments on the basis that "well, back then he was 18 and a very stupid boy, but now he's 27 and slightly more intelligent," As if that justifies it somehow.

But you can't hold people to account for ever for silly things they do at 18. There is something called forgiveness, or there should be. Blimey how many 18 year olds have done things that in latter life they regret? People are very quick to criticise others without looking closer to home. We love the blame culture.

Chinaman wrote:This is opening up a giant can of worms that will likely tear cricket apart, and maybe other sports as well. Whatever your view there will be no winners here.

The winners will be the future generations who don’t have to go through the treatment that Rafiq has received without having the culture in the game that allows them to speak up and have it robustly investigated at the time it’s happened. Reading your latest posts on this thread they do resemble the approach of the Yorkshire board. You are listening to what’s being said but you’re not hearing it.

Chinaman wrote:But you can't hold people to account for ever for silly things they do at 18. There is something called forgiveness, or there should be. Blimey how many 18 year olds have done things that in latter life they regret? People are very quick to criticise others without looking closer to home. We love the blame culture.

I thought Rafiq was incredibly impressive yesterday. His main target is not so much the individuals, it seems, but the mindset at the club which ignored this issue for years and saw him as the problem. Unfortunately it is hard to avoid naming individuals if you are not be dismissed as making generalised accusations which tar everyone with the same brush but I suspect if the players made genuine apologies he would exercise that something called forgiveness. He already has for Hoggard,

It is hard to see Ballance's banter defence - including from when he was captain, not a callow though well-educated 18 year old - as anything more than an illustration of the problem rather than an apology. Similarly those running the club, who seem to have remained wilfully deaf.

I would ask you what you think should have happened with Rafiq's complaints years ago and more public allegations now.

I'm sure other counties will not come out smelling of roses. Essex have had allegations made and Rafiq has said that a Middlesex player has been in touch. Many moons ago there was Titmus's treatment of Lonsdale Skinner and I'm sure he didn't acquire that sort of mindset when he crossed the Thames. I think you have to cut some slack for those whose formative years were in the days of empire but it doesn't make good reading.


Adelaide

Sounds like Harrison could be on the way out; one can only hope

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/350f4fc6-47c0-11ec-aa43-5cc5157b09b9?shareToken=1acefc7f2c2242ce5570864343478b5d

I've now watched the entire hearing and the only person of those involved who comes away with any dignity is Rafiq although Lord Patel might be in a position to heal some wounds.

Many people were shown up as disgraces including that well known benefactor, Colin Graves, who still seems to want to control Yorkshire CCC.

Is it possible for the first class counties to get rid of Harrison? I was under the impression that they lost much of their power some years ago.
I'm not sure many people would shed tears if he went and hopefully he can be persuaded to take his horrible hundread with him.

I wonder how many more cases will emerge following this awful revelation.

What a mess!!  It seems to me that there are broadly two categories of players involved at Yorkshire.   Some were aggressively racist.  Others like Root were not racist, but mistakenly and foolishly thought that names like Paki were only dressing room banter so ignored it.   Had Rafiq or others instantly reacted angrily I think there would have been some support,  

Gillespie is credited with vastly improving the situation, decent guy, the rest of Yorkshire management should hang their heads in shame and resign.

Interesting to read that Graves still completely controls Yorkshire.    He loaned the county a lot of money when they were financially desperate and can bankrupt the club anytime he wants by demanding it back!   I suspect that he has some responsibility for all this.

I have to say that Martyn Moxon is one of the nicest,friendliest,approachable people that i've ever met.

Badges wrote:I have to say that Martyn Moxon is one of the nicest,friendliest,approachable people that i've ever met.

Weren't the Krays kind to their mother or something?

The nicest, friendliest people can have whopping great blind spots, lack empathy or even be selective in whom they are nice and friendly towards. I've no idea where (if at all) Moxon fits along that spectrum but ibeing nice and friendly doesn't really tell you much.

Badges wrote:I have to say that Martyn Moxon is one of the nicest,friendliest,approachable people that i've ever met.

Jack Brooks is another.